praying for the dead maccabees

2 Maccabees is a deuterocannonical book of the Bible which focuses on the Jews' revolt against Antiochus and concludes with the defeat of the Syrian general Nicanor in 161 BC by Judas Maccabeus, the hero of the work. In the above two examples, one obviously more extreme than the next, we can see this is obviously the conclusion the reader must draw from the construction of the passage’s wording. *. Therefore he belted the boy, so that he might be delivered from his lack of discipline. Found inside – Page 83We are repeatedly reminded that in the Book of Maccabees prayers for the dead are encouraged as a " wholesome thought " ( ii . xii . 46 ) , and it is alleged that the sin - offering was made for the dead . This is not so . The text says nothing about prayers for these soldiers to exit purgatory, rather it had to do with resurrection (12:43-45). 2. In the Second Book of Maccabees (12:38-46), Judas Macabee orders that his soldiers that sacrifices and prayers be offered in the August 8, 2017 by PastorRich. In response, this must be noted. If you need to pray for the dead then Sola Fide isn't correct and the entire basis of the Protestant Reformation is unnecessary. Perhaps Augustine or Calvin disagrees, but to disagree one must read into the passage ideas that are not there. Change ). (For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should rise again, it would have seemed superfluous and vain to pray for the dead,) Plus, in this new edition, you'll find the updated text of the Mass according to the Roman Missal, Third Edition, as well as all-new chapters on creation, deepening your faith, and what joining the Church is all about. The revised edition is expanded and features beautiful, four-color mosaics from Marytown, home of the National Shrine of St. Maximilian Kolbe. Prayers for the dead are a much-disputed problem which we do not intend to discuss here. Found inside – Page 272And by the Maccabees, 1 Maccabees 4. And therefore Christian churches ought to be ... which it is certain the Jews to this day do not, and whereas the fact of Judah Maccabee is commended for praying for the dead, 2 Maccabees 12:44. The whole Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Church agrees. Prayer for All Souls Day II Just as Jesus died and rose again, so will the Father bring with him those who have died in Jesus. In other words, it amazes how how the rejection party always treats this as “praying for the dead” ignoring the statement “He also took up a collection, man by man, to the amount of two thousand drachmas of silver, and sent it to Jerusalem to provide for a [b]sin offering[/b]” and “Therefore he made atonement for the dead” … this is more about OT sacrifices having retro-active atonement power than any sort of “praying for the dead.” And quite frankly, I’m not aware of an OT passage that specifically says sacrifices have retro-active power, aside from 2nd Macabees, meaning the rejection of 2nd Macabees puts the retro-active power of Jesus’ sacrifice in jeopardy from the sola scriptura point of view (like from the perspective of someone playing Jews’ Advocate demanding that in order to prove Jesus’ sacrifice can atone for the sins of the dead, like Abraham and Moses, we must provide an OT passage showing that sacrifice can make retro-active atonement for the dead…..the only passage I could think of to prove that from the OT is in fact this one….so its too bad for the rejectors that its not in their OT). So, how can I help clear the air so to say? In doing this he acted very well and honorably, taking account of the resurrection. The Apocrypha, Lesson 14: 2 Maccabees and Purgatory. Praying for the dead. Answer (1 of 5): The King James Bible, along with virtually all other Protestant versions of the Bible (whether they are officially endorsed by a Protestant church or not), includes translations of the Hebrew books of what is now called the Old Testament. And so we pray in beautifully poetic language: Thank you for writing this post! Therefore he belted the boy, so that he might be delivered from his lack of discipline. Does 2 Maccabees Approve of Prayers for the Dead? Besides, that noble Judas exhorted the people to keep themselves from sin, forsomuch as they saw before their eyes the things that came to pass for … Change ), You are commenting using your Google account. During Easter Time, the First Reading is instead selected from among certain New Testament Readings. It had no ongoing relevance for a perennial purgation of ones nature in Hades. The Passage in Question. very well and honorably, taking account of the, the act of buying headcheese might not even be good, but rather the thoughtfulness pertaining to the soldiers’, Cliff Notes: Athenagoras’ Plea for Christians and On the Resurrection. Found inside – Page 113“ It is a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead . ” MACCABEES , ii . 12 . And can we do no more for thee , But lay thee in the tomb ? Bedew the grassy mound with tears , Bid Aow'rets o'er it bloom ? Dwell upon happy moments ... 43And when he had made a gathering throughout the company to the sum of two thousand drachms of silver, he sent it to Jerusalem to offer a sin offering, doing therein very well and honestly, in that he was mindful of the resurrection: 44For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should have risen again, it had been superfluous and vain to pray for the dead. Proving out the above via two examples. We are called to pray for the dead because our loved one could be in Purgatory. So, how can I help clear the air so to say? Found inside – Page 108In doing this he acted in a very excellent and noble way, inasmuch as he had the resurrection of the dead in view; for if he were ... Second Maccabees 12 does not provide a Scriptural basis for either purgatory or praying for the dead. It is therefore a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead, that they may be loosed from sins. We learn that purgatory is a process of purification that our hearts need in order to be ready to love God and to enter into his presence. Found inside – Page 24A painting by Peter Paul Rubens from 1618–1620 highlights the scene of Judas the Maccabee praying for his deceased soldiers (Musée des Beaux-Artes, Nantes, France). Because of their references to purgatory and res- urrection, ... It helped me. Tradition of praying for the dead still brings some Christians to cemeteries in November. August 8, 2017 by PastorRich. But if he was looking to the splendid reward that is laid up for those who fall asleep in godliness, it was a holy and pious thought. But the practice of praying for the dead is very ancient. 1011. Not all sin but only this particular sin. Though not all Christians embrace the practice of praying for the dead, the long-held tradition springs from Judaism, and Biblically, according to … What is the basis for the Catholic Church’s teaching about this? But one thing we can say–to the Jews prayers for the dead were by no means unknown. In doing this he acted very well and honorably, taking account of the soldiers’ hunger. So this Memorial Day, offer up a few prayers for those who died defending our freedom (and the freedom of others), as well as for all of the recently departed, including Joe Feuerherd. I look forward to the resurrection of the dead and the life of the world to come. One concerning theological teaching from 2 Maccabees is the concept of praying on behalf of the dead (2 Maccabees 12:34-35). In doing this he acted very well and honorably, taking account of the resurrection. -2 Maccabees 12:45b I Want People to Pray for Me… I have told my husband multiple times that at my funeral, I want everyone on their knees, begging God to open the gates of Heaven for me. Rubens painted Judah Maccabee praying for the dead; the painting illustrates an episode from 2 Maccabees 12:39–48 in which Judah's troops find stolen idolatrous charms on the corpses of Jewish warriors slain on the battlefield. This is clearly what the author is saying. Our prayers have no bearing on someone once he or she has died. Basically because he did not like the teaching about prayer and sacrifice for the dead in 2 Maccabees 12:39-46, he decided on his own singular authority, to dump … Prayers for the dead form part of the authorized Jewish services. (II Maccabees 12:46) What do you think? It is my hope that the following two examples I cooked up faithfully maintain the wording and flow of thought of 2 Maccabees. In doing this he acted very well and honorably, taking account of the resurrection. He also took up a collection, man by man, to the amount of two thousand drachmas of silver, and sent it to Jerusalem to provide for a sin offering. This book is written in first person; the subject is a middle aged woman who had been separated from her boyfriend some thirty years ago and then after three decades when she searches for an oncologist for treatment of an aggressive cancer ... Yet, we can agree that the passages wholeheartedly agreed with the intention of the otherwise questionable act. What the passage says in the above is rather simple. 2 Maccabees 12:44. The Aramaic phrase Paul uses in 1Corinthians 15:29 can only refer to immersion on behalf of the dead. This is what “prayer for the dead” is: prayer for souls in this intermediate state. B. Hieromonk Seraphim Charles, Donations for the Orthodox Church in Cambodia, The Orthodox Doctrine of Justification versus Roman Catholicism and Protestantism, The Orthodox Doctrine of Justification: The Biblical Teaching, More Proof Irenaeus Thought Jesus Lived to 50 Years Old. Either he is saved through faith in Christ and is in heaven where he is experiencing rest and joy in God’s presence, or he is in torment in hell. 2 Maccabees 12:42-46. 2 Maccabees 12 … 43 And making a gathering, he sent twelve thousand drachms of silver to Jerusalem for sacrifice to be offered for the sins of the dead, thinking well and religiously concerning the resurrection. ( Log Out /  They were not asking God to effect character change on the sinners in their present state of death but were asking for judicial mercy on behalf of the dead on resurrection day. During the Month of November, we pray for our loved ones that they might be healed of the effects of sin in their lives and be admitted into the eternal love of the Lord. 43–45, where the writer is uncertain whether to regard the sacrifice offered by Judas as a propitiatory sin-offering or as a memorial thank-offering, a distinction of great importance in the later history of the practice. Many people say that the Bible contains no references to purgatory. Change ), You are commenting using your Twitter account. 15:12-16.” (Protestant removes 2 Maccabees from the Bible). Change ). “It’s not in the Bible, so it is not important,” you say. Being that language should be understood in a consistent way, it is obvious that the author of Maccabees was to some degree uneasy with the actual prayer, just as much as I’d be uneasy with severe belting or feeding people headcheese. The tradition of praying for the dead traces back to Sacred Scripture. the next. Not all sin but only this particular sin. According to the Catholic Encyclopedia, the clearest Bible reference about prayers for the dead is from the Second Book of Maccabees. The Act of Buying Headcheese for Hungry Soldiers. 45And also in that he perceived that there was great favour laid up for those that died godly, it was an holy and good thought. Why do Catholics pray for the dead? Oblation of the Victim to God. This was done in prospect to the finality of this sin at the final judgment. Found inside – Page 113“ It is a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead . ” MACCABEES , ii . 12 . AND can we do no more for thee , But lay thee in the tomb ? Bedew the grassy mound with tears , Bid flow'rets o'er it bloom ? Dwell upon happy moments ... For if he were not expecting that belting would successfully discipline the boy, it would have been superfluous and foolish to beat the lad so tenaciously. It goes back to Judaism and is mentioned in the second book of Maccabees (2 Mac. Relevant Radio offers for most of our shows that air throughout the week. The latter argues that this reflects a New Testament example of prayer on behalf of the dead. Is the above an endorsement of belting or discipline in general? For example, it opens up the theoretical possibility for an intermediary status such as purgatory after dead. Change ), You are commenting using your Facebook account. For if he were not expecting that those soldiers were hungry, it would have been superfluous and foolish to buy so much headcheese. From the Lectionary for Mass, no. Calvin thought 2 Maccabees contained a passage that approved of prayers for the dead. Luther found obviously prayers for the dead (probably implying purgatory) very well attested in II Maccabees 12. Without getting into Canonical disputes, a proper interpretation of 2 Maccabees is important for two reasons: First, it is a valid historical question whether or not contemporary Jews practiced intercessory prayers on behalf of the dead. The Roman Catholic Church uses 2 Maccabees 12:46 to support its teaching of purgatory and offering prayers for the dead. For example, it opens up the theoretical possibility for an intermediary status such as purgatory after dead. Like Eid prayer, the Janazah prayer incorporates an additional (four) Takbirs, the Arabic name for the phrase Allahu Akbar, but there is no Ruku' (bowing) and Sujud (prostrating). The Second Book of Maccabees is completely straightforward about praying for the departed, and praying to the Saints. Therefore he bought headcheese for the soldiers, so that they might be less hungry. 2nd Macabees supports the idea that a sacrifice can be retroactive for the dead (as Jesus’ sacrifice can save Adam and Eve). This project is part of the author's ongoing research into the origins and reasons for the acceptance of hell as a Christian doctrine. Michael Leno concludes that hell is one of the worst ideas ever invented. William Albrecht (Roman Catholicism) and Craig Truglia (Eastern Orthodox) debate: Does 2 Maccabees 12 Teach Prayers for the Dead? If so, then the early church’s continuance of the practice may be indicative of the practice always being accepted among the people of God from a time preceding the coming of Christ into the world. As the Church would later teach, prayer for the dead only makes sense if there is a temporary “place” after … View OrthodoxChristianTheology’s profile on Facebook, Notes on the London Baptist Confession – Jansenist Church, Notes on the London Baptist Confession – Rev. MotownGreek. .. Change ), You are commenting using your Facebook account. Your teacher tactfully avoided doing so to keep the Lesson on task. 2 Maccabees 12:46 Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA) 46 It is therefore a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead, that they may be loosed from sins. …By changing the focus of the passage to an action we would all condemn. So I was … 1) Salute ... the Household of Onesiphorus, 2) Answering an Attack Against Prayers for the Dead, 3) Saint Onesiphorus revisited - did he die before St Paul?, 4) Luther, 2 Maccabees, Purgatory or Prayers for the Dead. I have noticed that simple things may allude us when we, for whatever reason, want to disagree about something. The Apocrypha, Lesson 14: 2 Maccabees and Purgatory. Found inside – Page 509In chapter 12, the value of praying for the dead is commended. • In chapter 15, the book speaks confidently of the prayers of the saints in heaven for those on earth. Second Maccabees is less concerned with the facts of history than ... 12 :45). “It’s not in the Bible, so it is not important,” you say. The bells are rung once. God's people knew their prayers were efficacious for the dead even in the time of Maccabees Amen. 2 Maccabees demonstrates several points of doctrinal interpretation deriving from Pharisaic Judaism, and also found in Catholic and Eastern Orthodox theology. 41All men therefore praising the Lord, the righteous Judge, who had opened the things that were hid, 42Betook themselves unto prayer, and besought him that the sin committed might wholly be put out of remembrance. This book is a must have for all Christians who love sacred Scripture and desire to use it as God intended. What is the basis for the Catholic Church’s teaching about this? Augustine thought the same. It is a special case, granted, but these are nevertheless cases of praying for the dead. 2 Maccabees 12:44 (For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should rise again, it would have seemed superfluous and vain to pray for the dead,) 2 Maccabees 12:45 And because he considered that they who had fallen asleep with godliness, had great grace laid up for them. 2 Maccabees 13:1 Therefore he bought headcheese for the soldiers, so that they might be less hungry. “Therefore, (Judas Maccabeus) made atonement for the dead, that they might be delivered from their sin” (2 Maccabees 12:46). Found inside – Page 92Prayer ofAzariah (second or first century BC) (included in Roman Catholic Bibles as Daniel 5:24—90) . ... it supports praying for the dead (2 Maccabees 12:46) and working for salvation (Tobit 12:9); 5) it was not accepted by the peo— ... Thus he made atonement for the dead that they might be absolved from their sin.” (2 Maccabees 12:42-46) Hence, the practice of praying for the dead dates back to ancient times and has benefits for both the dead and the one who prays. Found inside – Page 168him on the apparent contradiction between the church's universal practice of praying for the dead and the words of the ... The way in which Augustine refers to the book of the Maccabees suggests that Paulinus had also questioned the ... Praying for the dead is not a biblical concept. Recap. Here is what 2 Macc 12:43-45 says about how Judas Maccabeus responded to  slain soldiers of his that died with idolatrous amulets on their persons: He also took up a collection, man by man, to the amount of two thousand drachmas of silver, and sent it to Jerusalem to provide for a sin offering. Besides, that noble Judas exhorted the people to keep themselves from sin, forsomuch as they saw before their eyes the things that came to pass for the sins of those that were slain. Found inside – Page 24for the dead ? The following are the words of your version , beginning with the forty - third verse of the ... We find by the historyof the Maccabees , that the Jews did pray and make offerings for the dead ; which also appears by other ... 3:13–15) which the Roman Catholic Church added to the Bible in a.d. 1546 in response to the Reformation that condemned such practices. This is why we have prayers for the souls in purgatory — because, quite simply, they cannot pray for themselves. Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. The Passage in Question. The whole Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Church agrees. Fee is more cautious. Therefore he made atonement for the dead, so that they might be delivered from their sin. He also took up a collection, man by man, to the amount of two thousand drachmas of silver, and sent it to Jerusalem to provide for a sin offering. A reading from the second Book of Maccabees. Judas gains divers victories over them. Jesus' death begins the Christian life through the forgiveness of sins. Jesus' resurrection ends the Christian life resulting in resurrection from the dead for all people. It is true, death and resurrection are one time events for Jesus. 41 All men therefore praising the Lord, the righteous Judge, who had opened the things that were hid, 42 Betook themselves unto prayer, and besought him that the sin committed might wholly be put out of remembrance. ( Log Out /  Individual Daily Prayer, from the Book of Common Prayer, Bible Versions NIV and NKJV. Change ), You are commenting using your Twitter account. Roman Catholics will often claim that purgatory is affirmed even before the time of the New Testament in the Jewish Apocryphal book of 2 Maccabees. The Church has had a long-established practice of offering prayers for the dead based on 2 Maccabees 12:46, “Therefore (Judas Maccabeus) made atonement for the dead, that they might be delivered from their sin.”. For if he were not expecting that those who had fallen would rise again, it would have been superfluous and foolish to pray for the dead. In doing this he acted very well and honorably, taking account of the soldiers’ hunger. But the most valiant Judas exhorted the people to keep themselves from sin, forasmuch as they saw before their eyes what had happened, because of the sins of … 2nd Macabees supports the idea that a sacrifice can be retroactive for the dead (as Jesus’ sacrifice can save Adam and Eve). For if he were not expecting that those who had fallen would rise again, it would have been superfluous and foolish to pray for the dead. Second,if prayers for the dead were understood by early Jews and Christians to be efficacious on behalf of the deceased, there are serious ramifications for this. Search Tips In order to find a subject for a specific show, search for the name of the show host, and the subject matter you are searching for. Treasury of Scripture Knowledge. Found inside – Page 5The Maccabees: Remembering the Dead For if he were not expecting that those who had fallen would rise again, it would have been superfluous and foolish to pray for the dead. (2 Maccabees 12:44) Reverence for the dead has existed since ... 1 The Jews in Jerusalem and in the land of Judea send greetings to their kindred, the Jews in Egypt, and wish them true peace! Hieromonk Seraphim Charles, Donations for the Orthodox Church in Cambodia, The Orthodox Doctrine of Justification versus Roman Catholicism and Protestantism, The Orthodox Doctrine of Justification: The Biblical Teaching, More Proof Irenaeus Thought Jesus Lived to 50 Years Old. 2 … We also offer funeral pre-planning and carry a wide selection of caskets, vaults, urns and burial containers. Fr. Conclusion. Judas and the remaining soldiers did not condemn them but committed justice into the hands of God alone, and washed their hands from blood guilt. Second, 2 Maccabees 15:14 speaks of Jeremiah praying for the people on Earth, introducing what Catholics teach as the prayers of the saints, a doctrine not found in the Old and New Testaments. Revelation 21:1– 8. Public Domain ( Why are modern Bible translations copyrighted?) The purpose of this book is to help people understand what God our Creator requires from us in this life because that determines where and how we will be spending forever in our next life. ( Log Out /  Begin to gain greater peace as you practice praising God with this unique gift book. Two additional sections in "Everyday Praise" will further immerse you into this idea of praise. PROOF # 2: MACCABEUS WHO PRAYED TO THE LORD FOR HIS DEAD COMRADES. Found inside – Page 78Calvin's Institutes , in the discussion of prayers for the dead , contained the following passage : ' But ... the principal biblical proof text traditionally cited in support of the practice of prayer for the dead , 2 Maccabees 12.43-5 ... Protestants can't accept Maccabees as inspired for the simple reason that it solidifies the pre-Christian basis for praying for the dead. Judas and the remaining soldiers did not condemn them but committed justice into the hands of God alone, and washed their hands from blood guilt. Protestant: “Prayers for the dead and prayer to the Saints aren’t in Scripture!” Catholic: “Sure they are. The custom of setting apart a special day for intercession for certain of the faithful on November 2 was first established by St. Odilo of Cluny (d. 1048) at his abbey of Cluny in 998. Unlike 1 Maccabees, 2 Maccabees was written in Koine Greek, probably in Alexandria, Egypt, c 124 BC. This is not to disparage the humility, compassion, mercy, and love that flow from the New Testament characterization of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Doctrinal issues that are raised in 2 Maccabees include: Prayer for the dead and sacrificial offerings, both to free the dead … Therefore he made atonement for the dead, so that they might be delivered from their sin. I had everything a woman could ask for and more yet somehow and someway I forgot about myself and ended up in the purgatory of living. Appeals From The Heart To God, is an inspirational poetry book written with you in mind. Perhaps Augustine or Calvin disagrees, but to disagree one must read into the passage ideas that are not there. In this superb volume, Geisler and Roach have demonstrated once again that the attack, though an old one, must and can be answered. Anyone engaging the culture needs to read this book. Prayers for the dead are mentioned in 2 Maccabees xii. Judas Maccabees was an important Jewish general of the second century before Christ. We learn that purgatory is a process of purification that our hearts need in order to be ready to love God and to enter into his presence. These books never supported purgatory, and the only reason so many people think they don’t belong in the Bible is they’ve been lied to and brainwashed into thinking they do! 2 Maccabees 12:44-46 (Douay Rheims-Bible) [44] (For if he had not hoped that they that were slain should rise again, it would have seemed superfluous and vain to PRAY FOR THE DEAD,) [45] And because he considered that they who had fallen asleep with godliness, had great grace laid up for them.” (See 2 Maccabees 12:46 "It is a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead… Δdocument.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Enter your email address to follow this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. This prayer book is geared towards teaching our children love for self, love for others and to be appreciate of all God's creation. In their formative years, is indeed the perfect time to do so. I believe the examples make clear to the reader that the action in the passage is not what is not being approved of, but rather, the rationale for committing the action. In 2 Maccabees 12:43-45 we read of prayers and sacrificial offerings made on behalf of the dead. Rather, it reads like a careful apology for a revered man, George Washington, committing a shameful act for supposedly good purpose. It can’t be denied. To pray for the dead is therefore an act of charity and of piety, certainly obligatory for a Christian who professes to have charity in his heart. We use the term purgatory, or place of cleansing, as the state of those waiting full entrance into the love of the Lord. The embolden is an obvious qualification. Augustine thought the same. 2. The Books of Maccabees present a firm belief in the eternal life of those who have lived for the Lord and a belief in praying for those who have died. Tom’s mother was likely of a denomination that did not recognize the books of Maccabees as part of sacred Scripture. That is why we should pray for our deceased family members and friends who have gone before us. 8 … The Old Testament’s Second Book of Maccabees relates the story of … Is the above an endorsement of belting or discipline in general? But if he was looking to the splendid reward that is laid up for those who fall asleep in godliness, it was a holy and pious thought.

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